[eDebate] Falwell

[Andy Ellis]

This is not a guy who buys pepsi when i am a coke man...its not opples and
boonoonoos...again my argument is not we cant celebrate the good parts its
that the bad parts outweigh them...I will say again i would trade everygood
thing he did in debate if it meant he would not have led the moral majority
to their increidible political power...

On 5/15/07, jpzompe at ilstu.edu <jpzompe at ilstu.edu> wrote:

>

> Abhoring Falwell's politics, but respecting what he did for debate, is not

> "downright dangerous."

>

> It is a political reality -- a reality that apparently you have no

> grasp of. The point of the matter is that we live in a world where

> people don't always

> agree.  We have differences.  I don't appreciate some of the comments or

> policies that emerged as a result of Falwell, but that doesn't mean I

> can't

> appreciate some of the good things he did.

>

> Your politics is the one that is dangerous, Andy.  If we all believed as

> you,

> dogmatism would rampant throughout every town and city in America.  No one

> would ever get along.  Violence would be commonplace in your world, where

> it

> was okay for people to dismiss literally everything other people do or

> believe

> simply because there is a disagreement.

>

> There is nothing wrong with feeling passionate about what you believe,

> Andy. But therein is where you have more in common with Falwell than

> you'd probably

> like to admit.

>

> zomp

>

>

> Quoting Andy Ellis <andy.edebate at gmail.com>:

>

> > Uh, there seem to be a few arguments from a resounding number of posts.

> >

> > First let me say.. I apologize to falwells family, friends, students,

> and

> > supporters, if any of them are reading edebate on this terrible day then

> i

> > am sorry if my words have added to their sorrow, and suffering....i

> honestly

> > thought my response was not likely to even be a blip on the "sorrow"

> radar

> > for those intimatly connected to this death, and i honestly still think

> > thats the case...i think its realitivly easy to pile on and say there

> goes

> > andy being rude and insensitive, and this is the worst sin ever, but

> really,

> > its not, and im not at the familys space telling them that their man

> > deserved to die, nor am i desecrating his grave, and in reality if he

> was an

> > important part in your life why the hell are you cocnerened on this day

> > about what i have to say about it?

> >

> > Now some answers....

> >

> > Kevin talks about times when falwell made him smile when he was alive.

> >

> > i agree i love the fact that he submitted himself to a debate community

> that

> > was for the most part hostile to him, in fact i think its a sign that he

> is

> > strong in his convictions.

> >

> > I smiled at these times as well.

> >

> > I also smile when i think about the debate team he created, and the

> region

> > his support helped to thrive.

> >

> > Maybe, at times that didnt seem clear. and maybe it wasnt even at times

> to

> > me, but at the end of the day good job on building a great debate team,

> ill

> > never take that away from him...

> >

> > But i guess when i remember back to those banquets what i most

> appreicated

> > was the way falwell stood by his convictions, he preferred to spar with

> > those who disagreed with him, not to engage in friendly banter with

> those

> > who agreed, he stood from a position of power, i mean he was winning the

> > fight for the soul of america that he had been engaging for several

> decades,

> > and those that vehemetly disagreed with him where a sign of his success.

> >

> >

> > Then a bunch of people say...But damn he did sooooooo much for debate.

> >

> > Let me put this this way. I voted for melissa wade as god on facebook, i

> > think she rocks...solid....if in addition to the debbate work she did

> she

> > started a eurohetropatriarchy supremacist movement, that spread viraly

> > through the american political culture i dont really think i would

> ignore

> > the white supremacist movement in order to celebrate her debate

> > success....simply put i can concede all the jerry good for debate

> arguments

> > and if the cost of all that is the power of the moral majority in

> american

> > politics then its not worth it.

> >

> > Im sorry if that notion is troubling, but to me its absolutly scarry

> that

> > "no one hates  the politics as much as i do" but he WAS good for debate.

> >

> > Did you ever think that perhaps he started and supported the debate team

> and

> > the college in the futherence of that politics?

> >

> > Even not making that argument im just not in the for the "he helped us

> so we

> > will side step his evil" argument. You may say my its good when people i

> > dont like die argument is a jsutification for all sorts of bad stuff,

> but it

> > at least is no worse than " but he was good for debate"

> >

> > Herndon Says...how do you honor his life,...i think its simple, i dont

> > pretend for thesake of civility he did not accomplish all that he did. I

> > vehemetly disagree with what he accomplished, but you all seem to be

> willing

> > to like pretend most of that work didnt occur and al he did was hook up

> some

> > underserved debaters.

> >

> > Lets see what else...

> >

> > why didint you celebrate saddams death, what if you died, you arnt

> > consistent, you are an ass....oh and falwell was not a dictator like pol

> > pot...ok fair enough and neither was che or reagan or cheney , look the

> > point of all that was that people who are as politically revolutionary

> as

> > falwell, inevitably through their success generate dislike and hatred,

> most

> > of them like falwell have some blood on their hands as a result of their

> > politics, thus some people smile when they die....

> >

> >

> > really, i dont get what this fight is about, i may have been

> insensitive,

> > but in order to challeneg my insensitivity you all are making some

> > tragically bad arguments...not all of you mind you, but the ones who say

> " i

> > hate his politics but he has done so much for debate" are downright

> > dangerous.

> >

>

>

>

> --

> Joseph P. Zompetti, Ph.D.

> Director of Forensics

> Illinois State University

> School of Communication

> www.isuforensics.com

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------------

> This message was sent using Illinois State University Webmail.

>

>

>

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