[eDebate] Challenge to the Community

[Andy Ellis]

So tell me omri (and i dont ask this with the lazy revolutionary bombast i
often espouse) what have you learned from a year of milliken debates that
you are now using and working with your debaters on to address racial
discrimination in education?

On 4/4/07, Omri Ceren <ceren at usc.edu> wrote:

>

> No. You just don't get it.

>

> There's actually a relatively robust criticism to be made of you,

> tracing how risk-free revolutionary posturing can hold the good hostage

> to the perfect while using aggressive smugness to insulate intellectual

> laziness. So for instance, no one of any intellectual care would claim

> to have seen the best debaters in the country claiming that "law is [the

> best method]... of pursuing racial justice in education". First of all,

> outside of a very precise use in pyschoanalytic critical literature,

> "the Law" isn't a meaningful category. There are multiple branches and

> levels of government empowered to enforce legislative and judicial

> decisions - and while I know that most of the debates that you saw this

> year didn't really think that those distinctions mattered, that's kind

> of my point too.

>

> Anyway, like I said - there's a relatively robust criticism of your

> personal sensibility, political ideology, and interpersonal community.

> But I doubt you'd get it.

>

> Omri.

>

>

> On 4/4/2007 3:00 PM Andy Ellis wrote:

> > Uh right, i will continue to do the work outside of the legal structure

> > and in it when necessary to increase minority access to and completion

> > of college. I dont doubt the  efficacy of my methods, and sure i didnt

> > see the same debates you saw but my term heard and i saw many teams

> > adamently defending the necessity of using the law to challenege racial

> > discrimination and i am simply asking those that made the claims to

> > follow up on them.

> >

> > Furthermore i understand debaters cant sue for other peoples

> > inclusion(in a basic sense of the term i think there could be a claimant

> > who suggested that they where damaged by the lack of minority inclusion

> > in the community, but im probably wrong like you said im not in the

> > highly technical debates) but there are legal cases and movements that

> > debaters can contribute their skills and dedication to and furthermore

> > if through those super high end debates you saw provide the training

> > they promise then it seems as if you can figure out how to uses cases on

> > your campus as entree points to legal justice movements.

> >

> > or maybe all those things i heard in debates where just lies and nods to

> > racial inclusion?

> >

> > On 4/4/07, *Omri Ceren* < ceren at usc.edu <mailto:ceren at usc.edu>> wrote:

> >

> >     Andy,

> >

> >     Surely you should be leading this effort, what with all of the

> >     topic-specific research that I'm sure you did this year. And with

> all

> >     the high-tech policy rounds that you judged and scouted.

> >

> >     Omri.

> >

> >     On 4/4/2007 9:55 AM Andy Ellis wrote:

> >      > So after a year of hearing debates about how the law is not only

> >     a good

> >      > means of pursuing racial justice in education, but the best

> method, i

> >      > have a challenge to offer. Use the skills that you have acquired

> in

> >      > debating about the law to craft a strategy that uses the law to

> >     increase

> >      > meaningful minority participation in the community. The NCAA has

> been

> >      > sued for admissions requirements that preference test scores and

> >     gpa, if

> >      > there is precedent in that or other cases there should be a case

> >     to sue

> >      > your university or your debate team or ceda or the ndt, if they

> have

> >      > those standards. But dont let my suggestions limit you, many many

> >     many

> >      > of you have researched and learned a whole lot about using the

> >     law to

> >      > fight for racial justice in education, you im sure can come up

> with

> >      > something on your own.

> >      >

> >      >

> >      >

> >

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >      >

> >      > _______________________________________________

> >      > eDebate mailing list

> >      > eDebate at www.ndtceda.com <mailto:eDebate at www.ndtceda.com>

> >      > http://www.ndtceda.com/mailman/listinfo/edebate

> >      >

> >      >

> >      >

> >

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >      >

> >      > No virus found in this incoming message.

> >      > Checked by AVG Free Edition.

> >      > Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.26/746 - Release Date:

> >     4/4/2007 1:09 PM

> >

> >

> >     --

> >

> >

> >     --------------

> >     PhD Student, USC Annenberg School for Communication

> >     Email: ceren at usc.edu <mailto:ceren at usc.edu>

> >     Mobile: 412-512-7256

> >     --------------

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >

> > No virus found in this incoming message.

> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.

> > Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.26/746 - Release Date:

> 4/4/2007 1:09 PM

>

>

> --

>

>

> --------------

> PhD Student, USC Annenberg School for Communication

> Email: ceren at usc.edu

> Mobile: 412-512-7256

> --------------

>

>

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://www.ndtceda.com/pipermail/edebate/attachments/20070404/077bcb99/attachment.html